Devices themselves aren’t so important anymore; what matters is what results they enable. This is causing major changes across the telecoms industry, and mobile data’s ubiquity and flexibility puts it at the heart of that change.
Our Sales Director Bernie McPhillips and Business Development Director Rich Crossingham took over the podcast this month to examine this change and debunk some of the misconceptions around mobile data. Give it a listen.
Bernie McPhillips
Hey everyone, thanks for tuning in to the IoT Insider this month. I’m Bernie McPhillips, Sales Director of Pangea. You’re stuck with me this month as Dan our Managing Director is on holiday. So we thought it was a good opportunity for another takeover. I’m delighted that I’m joined by our Business Development Director, Rich Crossingham to take a look at how mobile data is changing everything we know about telecoms. How are you today Rich?
Rich Crossingham
I’m great, Bernie, I’m looking forward to taking over one of these podcasts again, slightly gutted that I’m not on holiday. But this is, yeah, this is just as good.
Bernie McPhillips
That’s ok, given the choice of being on a holiday or recording a podcast I know where I’d rather be, and here we are. So what we’re going to do is looking at different industries, finding out about where opportunities are, helping our listeners and partners to make the most of the mobile data opportunities. So if you look at pretty much any industry, today, you’ll find out it’s all about user experience, are customers getting the solutions they need, are they connected in ways that work for them? And now more of a common phrase, a digital convenience, people don’t just want to be able to transact in the way that they used to, they want to be hugely convenient, they want experiences at their fingertips. The devices themselves aren’t really that important anymore, although I’m sure a lot of the manufacturers would beg to differ. What really matters now is the results that these devices enable. And mobile datas ubiquity and flexibility, really put it at the heart of that change. I’m really, really delighted that you’re with us today, Rich, because obviously your background is in a lot of areas of fixed connectivity. And in Wi-Fi, a very different technology to what we’re going to be talking about today. And you’ve been at Pangea for for quite a while now. So what kind of things have you seen? How are you seeing that difference?
Rich Crossingham
I think, without cutting it too fine on the life of Wi-Fi, I think we’ve reached a point where the use of it and the value that was seen with it by the retail industry and other industries that were having their customers use the solution, probably now, more brought into question, with all the apps we have nowadays, all the capability we have on our own device and the increased connectivity that’s available just to the end user. So the key thing for me really is that Wi-Fi was still a single connection, a single router, providing a single way of getting out to the internet, whereas mobile gives you the ability to potentially use all of the UK networks being able to benefit from where some are better. And you just can’t get that kind of flexibility with fixed. And then you start looking at all of the other hurdles you have to cross off when you’re going through installation of fixed infrastructure, buildings with grade listings and asbestos, civils needed and approvals and having to dig up the road and then people shoving your primary and your backup in the same conduit that goes back to the same location. And you look at all of those things. And you think, Wow, actually, mobile seems to be a really enviable method of connectivity when you stack up all of those issues.
Bernie McPhillips
Yeah, it certainly is. You think of the, you know how often we use our mobile devices today. You know, that’s something that we speak about a lot in our business, not just mobile phones, but anything that can be connected to the internet, that could be a tablet, a PDA signature capture device, some form of sensor. I mean, everything around about us is connected. So yeah, we’ve all been studying quite a lot recently, haven’t we? What do you see in around kind of mobile phone usage and data consumption? You know specifically here in the UK? What are the trends at the moment?
Rich Crossingham
I think it would. It wouldn’t be an overemphasis, if you said that we’re all pretty much addicted to our smartphones and 99% of the UK population owning a mobile device. And whilst you know everyone has a mobile it’s not necessarily the mobile itself nowadays that is attractive, you know, they all look pretty much the same. We don’t have the the matrix style press and you know, the banana phone that flips open or the clam phone and all those things are kind of gimmicky now. Well, yeah, you’ve got the ones that unroll. I’ve seen some of these ones that look really cool, but right now in the market, the majority of the phones that have the biggest penetration to the market look almost identical. And what it is, is a conduit to an enabler of the internet It enables you to get there, it’s the internet connection that makes us want to do and use the phone as much as we do, whether it’s gaming or social media or anything like that. I think if you don’t have an internet connection on your phone, it’s just; well, it’s a box with stored photos. And maybe if you actually still buy physical media or download songs, as opposed to have a subscription, it might have some music. So it’s basically an iPod. So I think if you look at the UK, specifically, you know, mobile data traffic’s grown fivefold from 2016 to 2021, which has a compound annual growth rate of 38%. Anyone who’s looking at their pensions would be very happy with that kind of return. And I think in the UK, mobile data traffic will reach around 580 petabytes per month in 2021. And that’s up from 114 petabytes per month in 2016. Which means I guess that everyone is streaming music now as opposed to downloading it as I suggested earlier.
Bernie McPhillips
And you think that kind of growth though Rich, I mean, five times growth in five years. I don’t think there’s many industries that could boast that and certainly not many sectors within telecoms or ICT unified comms wherever you want to you wherever you want to kind of put us that could boast that kind of growth within five years. And if you think of voice is probably on decline, or traditional voice, at least anyway, and even SMS messaging because I think a lot of voice and messaging traffic now probably goes over a data network, people would tend to FaceTime or similar platforms or WhatsApp to make calls, especially internationally. And now even messaging. It’s very rare, you send an actual text, it’s only messaging through a particular platform, which carries that information over a data network, which all just means more and more data, right? That’s probably quite, a thing years ago, people think mobile phones were something you make a call from, that’s probably going to become something of the past, I would imagine, or some kind of retro activity that we take part in every now and then.
Rich Crossingham
Yeah, and the idea of, I mean, for the end user, it’s brilliant, because the idea of calling your friends in Japan or Australia, and having a 20 minute conversation, and then a 50 pound phone bill for that one conversation they’ve gone, because you can just WhatsApp message each other and then have a WhatsApp group call with seven, however many people on that WhatsApp group, or whichever application you might be using, and it’s free, all you had to do is have the internet capability, which is just incredible. I think when you look at how it’s affected Pangea specifically, Pangea themselves saw a 500% increase in data consumption across our active services in 2020. So that just shows you the usage, the amount of usage is just incredible, what’s it over 40% of email in the UK is opened via a mobile device now? And something like it’s more than half of all internet users connect to the internet via a mobile device, which I think is incredible, because it’s yeah, just mind blowing.
Bernie McPhillips
Yeah. And so much is changing, you reference there, even in the last 12 months, 500% increase, how many people are now using these services, whether it’s just accessing the internet, or opening your emails, more and more people are doing this via a mobile device, and therefore, a lot of the time on a mobile network. As a result of that, I think the way we’re thinking about mobile data is evolving. The way we provide services to customers, not a lot of businesses are single site anymore, we’re not as Pangea, couple of offices, and companies are becoming more and more hungry to not just hungry to stay connected, it’s essential. Connectivity is often now the lifeblood of businesses, including our own, if you’re not connected, you haven’t got access to your CRM system to be able to converse with your customers, often you can’t make or receive calls, because you know with the big switch off in a few years, our residences and businesses are all getting switched over to digital and as opposed to analogue lines. So without connectivity, you kind of may as well pull the shutters down on a lot of businesses because you can’t really function. Businesses making sure that their staff can match what was already a rapidly changing work environment. Even more so in the last 18 months, people now needing to work from anywhere. And so a lot of compliance and regulatory issues and requirements. Maybe it’s through call recording or not. If it’s you know if it credit card numbers being given by customers have to document conversations. There’s an awful lot of legislation when it’s in finance sectors, legal sectors, and even within companies making sure that things can be recorded from a human resource point of view. So really keen to hear your thoughts on that.
Rich Crossingham
I think it’s widespread as well. So it’s not just the business markets, the consumer market as well. I think everyone’s realised the finite capability of using what is a very old technology to prop up all of this. And you’ll see in the press recently, they’ve been the likes of BT and Sky offering mobile data backup with their fixed line packages, because they realise that people need to be on and they need to be on more often than ever now. And so they realised that ADSL, FTTC has its limitations, and therefore they need to be able to provide something to enable people to be connected. Whilst this is a really good thing, both of those examples use single network solutions so BT will use EE, Sky will use O2. And so the consumer needs to understand the level of connectivity in their property before deciding if it actually provides them adequate failover or not, they need to do the due diligence in their location, because it may well be that you don’t have good connectivity. So it won’t be a viable failover for you. There are probably better ways to do this. We’ll probably talk about them later, you know, our Unsteered Multi-network Solutions, which get around those issues. You know, 5G needs no introduction at this point, it’s already changing how we think about connectivity. The worldwide spend on 5G by telcos averages at about 105 billion each year. And with that kind of investment, they need to recoup these costs with new products and services, not just replacement ones, but new ones.
Bernie McPhillips
Yeah, they certainly do. I love that you touched on those things right around, you know, 4G / 5G backup, the need to be always on, single network mobile broadband just doesn’t always cut it. Multi-network services are more resilient, easier to deploy, allow the device to connect based on signal strength. And that’s before we even touch on things maybe around like IP addressing a lot of business grade solutions, okay, maybe not affecting the consumer examples that you spoke about. But a lot of business applications will require maybe very specific IP addressing in order to function properly and give all of the the functionality that comes with those services, which you’re just not going to get with those at all. But you’re right, 5G wow, I mean, just causing wide sweeping changes right across the entire telecoms industry, for sure. It’s a real delight now that we’re able to offer these services to a range of partners in a variety of different ways. That now means there’s absolutely nothing to fear, whether you’re an internet service provider or a telecoms reseller, this is something to be embraced as an opportunity. And I think now, the lingering misconceptions are those that remain around mobile data’s weaknesses are entirely outdated. So I think it would be great if we could on this episode, you talk a little bit more about those misconceptions and debunk some of those myths. There is still this lingering belief that fixed line connectivity is more reliable than mobile data. And I know you’ve had a foot in both camps now right firmly, so really keen to hear your thoughts on that in a bit more detail.
Rich Crossingham
Yeah, it’s a good one to start with. So yeah, fixed line isn’t, isn’t more reliable, not by a longshot £5 billion and 16 million working days lost to broadband outages last year just in the UK can attest to that. And I think to our partners, we’d say you don’t want your customers to be part of that stat. It’s, it’s significant. As we’ve previously mentioned, in other podcasts and articles, the PSTN backbone that services like ADSL and FTTC sit on, they’ve been around since the Victorian era. And it’s quite incredible to think that the modern key method of communication still works on something that old.
Bernie McPhillips
Two empty cups and a piece of string.
Rich Crossingham
The outages mentioned they’re tripling on 2019 numbers. But I think that highlights the strain put on the network in a completely different way. With the moving of the workforce from the office back to the home. Then you couple that with the high demand for everything from entertainment, retail, ordering, shopping, clothes over the last 18 months, people haven’t gone to cinemas, they haven’t gone to shops. So the change was stark, and that is reflected in a tripling of numbers 2019 to 2020.
Bernie McPhillips
Yeah, certainly is and it’s a harrowing stat isn’t it. £5 billion, 16 million working days combined lost due to broadband outages it’s pretty frightening. From a network performance point of view, I think it’s quite well, kind of thought that download is king. So your download speed is essential. If we look at 2020, it’s only last year, one of the leading network operators who offered the fastest download speed that averaged 35 meg per second on average. So if you took all of their data transmissions across the whole of 2020, an average of 35 meg per second, which is pretty awesome. If you compare that to fixed internet, have to hold our hands up. When you compare the average speed of mobile data compared to the average speed of fixed data. That’s about 64. Okay, so 64 versus 35. What we’re talking about is progress and how things are changing. The speed of mobile internet is getting faster, right? It’s growing, it’s getting faster all the time. And that speed growth that how quickly it’s progressing, is outgrowing fixed connectivity. So if you look at how mobile connectivity in 2019, went up 22% to 2020, fixed connectivity did increase, fixed connectivity got faster, but only by 17%. So they’re both getting faster but mobile data is getting faster, faster. Does that make sense?
Rich Crossingham
And it’s fair to say that with more and more 5G that’s only going to increase isn’t it? That that disparity?
Bernie McPhillips
Absolutely right. Absolutely right. We’re talking about big figures, you know, we’re talking about £5 billion of lost revenue to the economy in the UK last year. The analysts and specialists are already talking about 5G boosting the UK economy, to kicking it back in the right direction by £158 billion within the next 10 years. Just because of the services, it’s going to enable the things it’s going to allow us to do, where we’re going to be able to work from it’s truly incredible. One of the things you did mention, and to dig into a little bit more, because it is a hot topic in the industry at the moment is the PSTN switch off. 2025 seems like a long way away, right? But we’re now three quarters of the way almost, you know, through 2021, so things go quickly. So, again, you’re big in this space, Rich you’ve done a lot of work in this area with our partners. So what have you learned? How are you helping our partners to future proof their businesses?
Rich Crossingham
Yeah, I think it’s, whilst it seems that it’s a bit far off, you know, we’re talking say, four years or less. It’s also fair to say that that is normally one or one and a half contractual time periods for PSTN estates, so you’ll sign it for three or four years. So you’re really talking about your next one, you might just resign it right now. But next time, it won’t exist. So it really is, you know, you’ve got one contract left on this. And I think people are really starting to wake up to it this year, there have been a lot of articles about this, you know, we sort of felt like we did some of the starting the ball rolling last year, with talking about this and saying, you know, people really need to be aware of what this means. And it does mean a lot of positive things as well. We’ve worked with a number of partners to help them future proof their customers estate, by providing Unsteered Multi-network SIM solutions to replace ADSL failover. And I think it’s an incredible proposition because well, for a number of reasons. First is that it provides a non fixed failover. So you’ve got your main solution, as fixed, and then you’ve got a non fixed failover. Kind of makes sense. But the reason that’s really beneficial is that a lot of the time fixed connections in a location are all routed back by the same conduit when one goes down, they both go down. They both go back to the local exchange, meaning that if the issues there, neither works. A second reason is that it’s a backup with a backup. The Unsteered Multi-network solution means that if the network the SIM is connected to goes offline, it can quickly find the next best one and join it. The third point is that it’s more cost effective. And people will always sit there going but mobile data is more expensive than having a dedicated fixed line, right? Well, yeah, but it depends how often you use it, you’ve got backup. So a lot of the time only a small percentage of failover is actually being used, which means a solution at not an insignificant cost is being absolutely underutilised. By being clever with tariffs, pooling data, doing things that you just can’t do with fixed solutions, a mobile failover can be a cheaper, better, future proofed proposition.
Bernie McPhillips
Beautifully put Rich, very articulate indeed, you’re right Unsteered Multi-network, I mentioned it earlier on. But I think I talk through these words in my sleep now but the power of it just can’t be underestimated at all, a truly Unsteered Multi-network service. It just means you can deploy anywhere without the hassle of planning around coverage, surveys that type of thing. And rest easy if there is a single network outage locally or even nationally. As you said, you’re just going to pick up the next best service. So we’ve rolled out an awful lot of these services and keen to talk to more of our partners about how we can help them future proof their business and also that of their customers as well.
Rich Crossingham
Definitely. I think it’s also important to say that it’s, while we talked about it just now as a backup solution. As a primary connection, it can be more cost effective as well. Why upgrade payment terminals and alarms from outgoing PSTN solutions to FTTP or SOGEA, that’s not cost effective, it would be far cheaper to use a mobile connection given the small amounts of data and the frequency of use.
Bernie McPhillips
Yeah, absolutely. And you mentioned a couple of solutions there even payment terminals, alarm lines, I think it would be surprising to a lot of our listeners and a lot of our partners when they understand what types of devices and applications are actually hanging off these PSTN lines. It’s not just phone lines. At the moment, elevators, intercoms, door entry systems, security gates, emergency cords, all of these things tend to be connected via a PSTN. I entered a premise a short while ago and had to press a button at the security gate as I entered, I could hear the device make the call, it was making a call over an analogue line, and then the security gate opened, these things are all going to be switched off in four years, which does sound like a long time away. I’ve genuinely not even thought of it by the way, you just put it Rich, you know, when you consider the lifecycle of the contract length that typically comes with this product? This is your last one, or you’ve done your last one already, if you just signed off recently. So it’s not four years away I’ll worry about it then, it’s a consider it right now. And maybe you’ve got customers that are currently using these services. It is kind of that old adage that’s been around in our industry a long time. If you’re not talking to those customers about the future, about future proofing their solutions and keeping them connected your competitors may well be. Yeah, absolutely. It’s been said about a lot of different technologies in our industry. And this one’s no different.
Rich Crossingham
Definitely. I’ve got one for you, Bernie. So one of the big ones I think people will always mention is, but what about mobile data coming with this huge risk of massive overages? You always remember years and years ago people would watch like an episode of friends while they’re on holiday in Spain and come back with an £800 bill.
Bernie McPhillips
Yeah it’s a great question, and something that we do get asked quite often. And I suppose what sets us apart and how we deliver these solutions is our investment in our own core network, our infrastructure, our platforms, basically to ensure that these services are truly managed. So the data can come onto our core network depending on IP addressing, we can provide alert notifications based on usage. We can look to cap services, if appropriate, or at least let you know that it’s gone over it’s data allowance. We can provide flexible tariffs that can go up and down based on seasonal usage. Or if your device is consuming data based on an event or human interaction, it could be an alarm that only sends data when it’s triggered, a payment terminal that only sends data when it needs to process a payment. So naturally, things will fluctuate month on month, it could be seasonal. And we can build flexible tariffs that go up and down based on usage. If you get near the top of the top tier with that flexible tariff, we can add more, you know, we try and do everything that we can to create flexibility, to avoid unexpected charges. We’ve got our own portal with all of our services integrated, API capabilities there to make it so easy for you to monitor and adjust every detail of your solution as applicable. So really just try to mitigate the risk of overage as much as possible, practically down to zero is what I would think.
Rich Crossingham
Yeah, I think it’s vital, flexibility is a key thing you just highlighted there. It’s absolutely vital that whoever you entrust to be your mobile data provider, has these capabilities. Can actually have demonstrable evidence through a portal or a method of updating API’s, things like that, to enable you as the partner and then your end customer to see these things and how they actually work and just to remove that fear. I think yeah, it’s it’s good people should not fear the days of huge overages if they’re working with the right partner. So what about mobile data in general, isn’t mobile data all about high volumes with low data usage?
Bernie McPhillips
I think in a traditional sense, potentially. A lot of acronyms in our industry M2M (Machine to Machine) was one that was used more often than not, but then IoT became more prevalent, because Machine to Machine technology is typically a device sending a tiny packet of data, could be a metre reading, a temperature reading, something to say I’m here and everything’s okay on a regular routine interval. So that would typically be high volume, small amount of data, the term IoT is now used a lot more. Because this is about essentially connecting everything and that often really changes the amount of data that is required. With the advancements mobile networks as well so 4G and now 5G, we can send much larger data files in shorter spaces of time almost close to real time data transfer, for CCTV footage, to be able to dial in remotely to a device, to see exactly what’s happening in real time. And that’s maybe something that wasn’t available many years ago, with 2G and 3G. Now, the way that we interact with our network providers, relationships with all of the UK providers and a number of international providers as well, gives us real flexibilities we’re proud to be able to offer any amount of data on any network, on multiple networks, on a single SIM, on any number of SIMs, pooling data, flexible tariffs, as we’ve mentioned. So the types of the solutions that we’ve helped our partners deploy could now range from many 1000s of 20MB SIMs, for tracking shipping containers or vehicles, it could then blend into something like a handful of 10GB SIMs, decent amount of data, nice revenue. Now, it could be for creating Mobile Wide Area Networks for a range of construction sites or a big retail presence, you can then use the other end of the scale, our luxury yachts, or public Wi-Fi on ferries, or large fleets of private vehicles, etc, that we’ve seen use multiple terabytes on a single service in a month. So I think the myth that M2M and IoT is all about small data and lots of it, it’s hard to make money unless you’re getting the volume, really has to be debunked forever, really kind of now and forever. There’s so much flexibility in every single vertical, so many opportunities in every business sector you could consider. And what we’d really love to tell our partners is you don’t need to change your complete strategy, whatever types of customers you’ve sold to in the past, based on your geography, or the specialism within your business, there will be opportunities within your existing customer base. So you don’t need to, you know, sit down and create a whole new strategy of how am I going to get into this IoT game, who I’m going to sell to? The answer would typically be right under your nose.
Rich Crossingham
And typically, they’re already buying something or thinking about buying something from someone.
Bernie McPhillips
Rich you wouldn’t believe it, a reseller that we brought on, quite recently, brilliant partner, we love working with them, ran some workshops, deal clinics with their sales people, you know, go and speak to their existing customers and come back and say, Well, this customer, we told them about Multi-network SIMs, and it’s ‘Oh, yeah. We know about them, we’re buying them from someone else, because we didn’t know you did them.’ Sometimes it’s just opening that conversation and letting the customer know what you’re capable of. The opportunities truly are right there in front of you.
Rich Crossingham
And there are so many different types of IoT connectivity as well. You talked about 4G / 5G, you then look at LTE-M, NB-IoT, the more historical 2G / 3G the sunsets around them and opportunities that they offer. And then there’s things like Sigfox, and LoRaWAN. So there’s so many different versions, and they all have key benefits, which lend themselves to specific solutions. And we, as the partner have the ability to help our partners understand and teach their customers about what is best, most cost effective, the best way to deliver the solution.
Bernie McPhillips
Yeah, they’ve all got their place. And it sounds like we’re bordering on getting almost technical here Rich. So I’m going to, I want to spin this one back to you because I think something that comes up quite a lot when we’re deploying mobile services is latency. So there’s the word latency. So given your background across different forms of connectivity, etc. What are we seeing from a latency point of view with mobile data connectivity these days?
Rich Crossingham
It’s key to understand if there is a requirement for the solution being deployed, to really have a minimum/maximum threshold for latency. A lot of the time it isn’t the case. Many use cases that were originally suggested for 5G, were actually easily delivered over 4G with no impact to the solution for either the end user or the customer in question. So then, the question always needs to be, you know, what are you doing? And why does lower latency or lag as gamers will call it, need to be so important for this location or this delivery of this service? I think historically, fixed connectivity will always provide your lower latency or lag than 3G or 4G would. But 5G has absolutely changed this. So you know, it offers comparable or better latency than fixed connectivity. And so for those few opportunities out there where latency is absolutely key, a very low latency is very key to delivering a solution, real time communication, things like that. So triage in an ambulance heading to a hospital saving a life, you know, you need to have real time connectivity, you need to ensure that you’re not being buffered to hell while you’re trying to explain what’s going on. So for those use cases, latency is very important. But I think they’re far and few between, if someone gives you 30 examples of what their customers have got, you’ll probably pick out one or two where, you know, latency is the key, specific requirement over every other thing that needs to be considered.
Bernie McPhillips
That’s a really interesting thought process. And I do wholeheartedly agree, 5G could often be a bit of a sledgehammer to crack a walnut I suppose then, or just a focus on the wrong thing. If it’s a centre that needs to send a temperature reading once a day, milliseconds probably don’t matter. Where you’re right, if it’s real time data around a patient who’s being transferred by an ambulance, etc, then, yeah, every millisecond counts. Really great thinking, I was kind of thinking of a bit of a car analogy that not everybody that goes to buy a car walks away with a 5 litre V8, because you just simply don’t need it, you know, those that feel they do fine. You don’t kind of always need that that type of performance. We’ve spoken about a lot, so some of the opportunities, money can we made, we’ve spoken about PSTN switch off, we’ve spoken about some of the technical components around latency, network performance trends, an awful lot in there. I suppose. It would be remiss of me not to ask, is it difficult to provide? You know, what do our partners need to do, does everyone need to go out and hire a specialist? What do they do next?
Rich Crossingham
I think they need to have a conversation with us, with one of us via any of the methods of conversation we have whether it’s a phone call, or an email, or seeing us at Margin in Mobile anything like that, because they don’t need to have a single mobile specialist in their team, they need to have a partner of choice, like Pangea, who is able to infuse their teams with the relevant knowledge for the opportunities to help them work out what the best way to provide a solution for their customer is. And I think, you know, that’s what we will bring to the table, we’ll enable them to do all of this, provide multiple options and just ensure that their customer is served with the best relevant knowledge for the solution they need.
Bernie McPhillips
Yeah, it’s perfect Rich. Absolutely what I would urge our listeners and partners to do as well is get in touch, speak with us. You don’t need to reinvent your strategy we said already, you don’t even need a specialist in your own business. We’ve invested in our own resource and got the experts in Pangea to help our partners every step of the way. So yeah, please, just do get in touch. I think we’ll wrap up for now Rich, I really enjoyed the takeover. I think we’ve covered an awful lot there, in what was an intriguing topic, I’d like to thank you for joining me. And think we’ll send Dan on holiday again, next month so we can take over again. To all of our listeners, please head to our website for more IoT podcasts, and blog content. While you’re there don’t forget to sign up for our monthly newsletter. And as Rich just said, you know, if you’ve got mobile data questions that we didn’t answer here, then give them a call. Give me a call, get in touch by any means or through our website. Rich you mentioned Margin in Mobile, thank you for that would be terrible if I’d forgotten, but yeah, if you’re going to Margin in Mobile this month, take the time to book a one to one with us, Rich and I will be there along with a couple of other colleagues, Dan and Jo. And we’ll show you just how easy and don’t forget profitable, it is to get started with mobile data. So thanks again Rich, it’s been a real pleasure. I can’t wait for the next one. Thanks for listening, and tune in again soon. Take care everyone.
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IoT Insider Podcast | Episode 11: Why IoT projects fail

IoT Insider Podcast | Episode 10: GlobeCom 2019 IoT tech reveals and 5G latest

IoT Insider Podcast | Episode 9: IoT in 2020 – Predictions and Preparations

IoT Insider Podcast | Episode 8: How to make money with IoT

IoT Insider Podcast | Episode 7: The world’s first smart, IoT-powered container fleet

IoT Insider Podcast | Episode 6: The 5G carrier playing field

IoT Insider Podcast | Episode 5: Taking our smart building energy management partnership to the next level

IoT Insider Podcast | Episode 4: Introducing Dr Arslan Usman

IoT Insider Podcast | Episode 3: Mobile World Congress 2019 Highlights

IoT Insider Podcast | Episode 2: Launching a 5G world first

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